~*2Deep*~

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200 Men Said….Let a Man be a Man

In 200 Men Said.... on 8 March 2011 at 12:02 am

        So, recently I wrote 2 blogs An Independent Woman’s Place [<~Click Here] and [Click Here~>] Deuces Dos & Donts, and the answers that I got back from them had a lot in common; Let the Man be a Man. WTF!? I have no clue what that means. I am just being honest. People say it all the time, but is there a Wikipedia page about letting a man be a man? Is it different in different cultures? Should the woman go by her culture or learn what that means in her man’s culture? Can you upgrade it? Find it on Amazon? WHAT!!!? You can’t come at me all ambiguous and what not. Didnt you tell me that one of the things that women need to do is to communicate EXACTLY what we are thinking because you can’t read our minds? Guess what…this doesn’t mean what you think it means. So, what does it REALLY mean to “let a man be a man”?

        Okay…I’m a big girl, I can admit when I need help. So, I needed help trying to figure out what this meant. Because in all honesty, in woman code, this translates to “Shut up woman and fix me some food”. You might as well call me a bitch and put me in geisha make-up. The phrase almost implies that a woman has the power to stop you from being a man, which then suggests the question of “why should I be with you if I can stop you from being a man?”. No, don’t shoot the messenger… I’m just saying…this phrase is looking a little swiss cheese-ish to me.

        Well, when I hear it I speculate that he means that he needs to be in control at that moment, or that I have stepped on his manhood a little too much. That is all I can do….. speculate. But… I also think that there are several different ways to let a man be a man, and each one is a sign of how much of a man the woman is dealing with. For instance, my godmother has this way of politely saying my godfather’s name that will shut the sentence down and change the topic. She was letting him be the man, in my opinion, but not embarrassing him nor letting him embarrass himself. He still got to maintain his pride. I have never , and I mean NEVER seen her raise her voice at him. Now what goes on in the privacy of that bedroom when you hear her call his name politely down the hall….that is on them. I am sure they have had disagreements… I have never seen it. The one thing that I have caught by accident is when my dad left his wallet at home after she reminded him to get it, he didn’t. So we’re at the restaurant and he is entertaining friends and family and the check comes. My mother knew what was about to happen, and I saw her playing around in her purse and then she slipped her credit card under the table and into his lap under his hand without missing a beat. THAT was letting my father remain a man so that he could place the card on the table and pay the bill. But, in letting him be a man, she had to be a woman to see what was needed and assist him. I have a STRONG feeling that guys around my age don’t see that as the definition of Letting a Man be a Man. So I asked them.

I asked my 200 Men…..

On my last question I saw pretty much the same response. What does “let the man be the man” mean to you and what should a woman do, or not do, to let the “man be the man”? 

        And since I never read the comments until I come back through to edit the formatting of the post…. I have no clue what you are about to read. The 200 Men Said….

  • Danny P: All of this isn’t this complicated. When it’s right, the two involved in the relationship are who they are and the couple is still one. All this [means is] let [it] be [the way in] which [it] is… if [letting] the person be who they are is [them being a ] cheating fool or something… well uh duh
  • Allen Ozark:   ??? not sure.
  •  Nigi “Pistol Star” Pu Yi: Its means, let the man think he’s in control even if you’re in control. Also, all duties that are designed for a man…let him do them even if you’re better. Eventually, if he’s a real man he’ll admit that you’re better at whatever and come to you for assistance, and rightfully so. [2Deep: This man never ceases to amaze me. But let him be in control even when he isnt…..isnt that lying? lol. Okay, Lie to my man. Check!]
  • DSMILEY1: Let the man be the man: in charge of houses chores like cutting the grass & washing the cars. Sometimes its good to switch out but [it] wouldn’t be the same
  • : !: it means if you have a Real Man, he leads the household in decisions..basically the King..but that doesn’t mean he is a tyrant. He should listen to advice from his wife and make good decisions. Basically, the way the Bible portrays it.
  • Lateef25:  maybe not nag so much about what you want. just tell him in a nice way or let it go
  • Kycajrome L: I believe [it] comes from the Old school archetype of when the Man was the provider and fixer of everything in the household…depending how a man was raised some still hold those values ,times are a little diff, but old or new ,Respect is what a MAN wants
  • on the rocks…: that statement is self explanatory.far be it for a man to explain what it is to be a man.especially to woman these days. they seem to have their own blueprint for us.lol ..check every 3rd female profile and it’ll have a laundry list of what a “REAL” man is

        Now you all know that I wasnt going to just STOP at some of these answers. So some side conversations came from them and they went a little something like this:

  • Vince V: I think that those answers are coming from men who feel insecure about their position in the household and basically wants the woman to run everything through him and let him have the final say so in what goes on in their relationship. when in my opinion a secure man who has good communication with his partner would trust his woman to be able to act as an extension of him to make good decisions with both his and her best interest at heart , but communication being the key. [2Deep: I simply love this answer…. he can stay…lmao]
  • Me: Sooooooooooo I noticed you said that a “woman to be able to act as an extension of him” What does that mean? And why cant it be the other way around? Just playing devil’s advocate here
  • Vince V: ok miss devil’s advocate….lol   Traditionally the man would always be considered the head of the household because he was the bread-winner. but as times have changed and women have become less dependent on men; whether it be cause of equality between men and women, or financial responsibilities within a relationship. the level of the playing field has evened out, and either one could be considered the “head”. but sticking with tradition, even though the field is even, with the male being the head; any actions performed by the woman would be considered “okayed” by the man, to anyone outside that relationship. which would mean she was just doing it for him cause he cant get to it. Now it can work the other way around but then that would not be a traditional type relationship, plus then you might  have a man with a really hurt ego about holding up the appearance of being the man of the house.
  • Me: Soooooooo what is a woman not suppose to do without her man’s permission?
  • Vince V: have sex with someone else….j/k lol   a woman doesn’t need her man’s permission to do anything….but a woman or a man in a good relationship keeps open lines of communication with each other. especially when decisions that are to be made affect one another.
  • Me: Okay….so to let a man be a man is to keep an open line of communication with him. That’s it? ( I swear you’re gonna get sick of me…lol) But I am trying to make sure that I understand before I post it.
  • Vince V: no, to let a man be a man is to let him run everything and make all the decisions and don’t question the things that he does. but i would personally like having the input of my woman in every decision that i make for us, and vice versa .
  • Me: How is THAT being a man?!!! That sounds like a dictatorship!!!!! OH I SWEAR YALL WILL BE SINGLE FOR LIFE WITH THAT ATTITUDE!!! lmao
  • that is just the way life has traditionally put men with women. but like i said, as for me ,i like having the input of my woman cause i feel like it keeps us closer and more in touch with each other
  • Me: Gotcha! No prob….. I thought that you had great insight… My readers should hear it. Oh.. wait.. my fault. I didn’t let the man be the man. *submits* am I allowed to put your comment on my page? lmao!

        Vince V was my favorite response, but I simply had to post my comments from Chub L. He keeps me cracking up and yet he still knows when to be serious. So here are his responses:

  • Chub L: Let the man be the man – let him get that door etc… Let him do for you what you shouldn’t have to do for yourself as his queen.
  • Me: That was your answer…. so what am I not suppose to do for myself as his queen?
  • Chub L:In the world that we live in today – It’s basically everybody for themselves, but my queen shouldn’t have to get her own door, ever. Everything else is pretty much up for grabs. I don’t have a problem with a woman’s independence at all. Whatever my independent queen will allow me to do for her is gravy. No qualms here. I’m open-minded – we can get the darn door for each other.
  • Me: So, it really is that important to a man to feel needed in a relationship? But is it just with tangible things? Does a man ever feel the need to be needed emotionally? Meaning, if she doesn’t want you to get the door but needs you to hold her every night… would you feel like less of a man?
  • Chub L: Being emotionally needed is even more of a necessity. The Queen needs for her king to not only be her rock while she’s awake -but to rock her to sleep and all the more rock her while she’s asleep. It is for the good of both. If my queen is kept happy then hence I will also be kept happy.
  • So, then… why do you think so much emphasis is placed on a man doing tangible things versus him being there for her in the emotional times?
  • Chub L : I haven’t got a clue – I can only speak for me – I do both. Many swear that what one does or demonstrates declares what they feel. That is true BS – we as human beings still need to hear and feel what mere tangible things can never satisfy.

        Soooooooo are you still as confused as I am? I don’t want to be alone, so don’t leave me out here alone on Confusion Island. I mean, I get it…. but I don’t get it. So, as long as I allow my man to do “things” for me, then he feels like a man and all is gravy. So, I shouldnt have to touch a door in the presence of a man, pull out a chair, or cut my grass ( I don’t know, so I am halfway there), and let him make all of the decisions. I have a feeling that there is a gray area here that is in need of a dye job. It can’t be that friggin simple. So if I live by these few rules I am allowing my man to be a man? SWEET!

        Okay, all jokes aside. I think it all boils down to respect. Do I respect my man to hear him out when he verbalizes his needs? Do I validate him when needed? Does he have an equal part in this relationship? I think THAT is where his concerns lay. Anything else is a dictatorship and it isnt going to happen over here. Respect for Respect should be the basis on which this blog should be concluded to. And Scene.

Sincerely,

~*My Mother’s Daughter*~

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200 Men Said….An Independent Woman’s Place

In 200 Men Said.... on 22 February 2011 at 12:02 am

        So, while on Twitter I asked some of my female followers to hit me up with questions that they wanted my 200 men to answer and I have several questions to ask until I die…lol. But one was in reference to the place of an independent woman in a relationship. Other questions trickled from that one question, but this post will be specifically about an independent woman in her relationship.

*Cues Ne-Yo‘s Miss Independent* or read yesterday’s blog Lyrically Speaking:Lyfe Jennings~Hero [<~Click to Read]

        Often times we hear how you have to be an independent woman, learn to stand on your own two feet, don’t rely on a man because all men are dogs yadda, yadda, yadda. Then on the flip side, we must learn how to Act Like a Woman, Think Like a Man. How can I when no one is wanting to give up the man code? lol. Just kidding. But in all seriousness…. the world, right on down to the Bible thumpers, would have you believing that in order to be in a committed relationship you must relinquish your feminine family jewels and trade them in for a hot stove, bare feet and Kate plus 8. How 50’s is that. My last name is NOT Stepford. So, are we allowing the world to tell females everywhere that they cannot excel in order to make a man’s ego feel at ease just to have a relationship? I hope not, because then I am going lesbian.

        There has to be a balance, right? There has to be a time where a woman can handle business like a strong and independent woman during the day and be able to submit to her man. Notice I said submit.. not bow down to, not stand behind, not be belittled by. I left my father’s house because I was grown… I BE DAMNED if I go into another man’s house and feel as if I can’t be the strong person that MY FATHER raised me to be in opposition of many of these knuckle heads. So, you actually have the good fathers to blame…lol. And yes, I know I am exaggerating, but if the exaggeration can be handled then everything else will be cleared up in its path as well.

So…. 200 Men were asked:

 Often times black women are made to feel bad for being independent women. Do you think that there is a place for an independent woman in a relationship w/ a man or does she have to change? 

        Ladies, back away from anything that has breath and high levels of testosterone. TRUST ME on this one. I havent even read the comments yet, I never read them before I write my part, so I have no clue what is going to be said.

My men responded with:

  • DSMILEY1: I like independent women because it makes us grow faster & makes life easier on choices we make together
  • Chub L: There is nothing wrong with being independent, but also allow a real man to be the man. Hey it’s truly a new day in our wonderful society for different levels off independence, but chivalry does not have to die in order for independence to live.
  • Kycajrome L: I almost want to say this is a silly question but, I know better, LOL so i’ll say if  [you’re] independent you won’t feel bad about being you (with out an attitude)…if some else can’t handle it….
  • MIAMI’S SON IS BACK !!!:  are u serious !! you took the time to ask me that dumb ass question!! but its called self-esteem, meaning the esteem of ones self. so if you have to ask that question, then your not independent !!!! your a poor excuse of a person [2Deep: I had to rip him a new one separately. Funny how people assume that all of these questions are personally mine. I have women sending me questions on Twitter, and even if someone asks, it could be for research purposes and it doesn’t make them dumb.. like this ass! That’s why I am not going to correct his grammar errors. Because if you’re going to call someone else dumb you might want to know how to use “you’re”…lmao!]
  • !: Never a problem for an independent woman being in a relationship but when it comes to the household, she needs to realize the man is the head of household, it’s a reason God set it that way…just like in all other species. You [can’t] have 2 leaders.
  • dorrance: yes but u have 2 make time for each other if not then, no, it wont work
  • DJ Urban Cowboy: I don’t think any [man] wants a woman who can’t support herself. There is little room to flaunt or boast your independence. If  [you’re] so independent that you have to boast about it, then you don’t need your man.
  • Marcel: If a woman would allow herself to be made to feel in such a manner because of her independence then that is not at all a woman. A woman knows what its is in which she desires, wants and deserves.
  • Code Name Bigsexy: THERE IS ROOM.BUT I THINK THE WOMAN STILL HAS TO LET THE MAN BE THE MAN
  • Vince V: Yes there is a place for her. as long as she is not always throwing it up in the mans face like she doesnt need him for anything and vice versa. because that would be a lie. to make a “relationship” work it takes 2 people, being there for each other mentally, physically, emotionally, and financially. and no neither person should have to change period unless they want to for some reason. i embrace the independent black women. i think that Ne-Yo, Jamie Foxx, and Fabolous state it best in Ne-Yo’s “Independent Remix”

 My FAVORITE ANSWER CAME FROM:

  • CHRIST- O: I DONT WANT A WOMAN THAT CANT STAND ON HER OWN. AN INDEPENDENT WOMAN HAS A GLOW ABOUT HER THATS WHY SHE STANDS OUT IN A CROWD. TWO INDEPENDENT PPL MAKE A GREAT COUPLE.

Get your glow on ladies!!!

Okay… so I lied.. I ended up reading this one as I was going back and editing. I love this one too:

  • Prestige “The One And Only”: She never has to change, a real woman will never have to compromise who she is naturally. Independent, stubborn, opinionated…is sexy and a black woman will and should remain such while still being able to allow a man to play his role as a provider.

(This comment sparked another question that will come up in a future blog. [Will post link Here])

        And of course, when a response catches my attention, I have to jump in and get clarification. So I began a conversation below:

  • Mr. Mayor**DARKSTARZ INC PREZ**: I know I’m late on this one but I had to really think on it… I don’t think there is anything wrong with an independent woman in or out of a relationship but I don’t think some woman should get into a relationship if they just feel like they don’t want someone they can lean on when they need too. Some women take it to a certain level that can sometimes make their man or anybody feel unnecessary…. Just for example, sometimes the simplest thing like allowing a man to open a door for them… I have experienced women who actually give off an attitude when I have tried to do things like that… And I’m like “Wow, you don’t even want your door opened? That makes you less independent?” And I just think women go overboard with the “Independent Woman” thing.
  •  Me: How are they going overboard?
  • Mr. Mayor**DARKSTARZ INC PREZ**: They are going overboard because they are starting to take men being polite and chivalrous as trying to impede on their independence. 
  • Me: Oh okay, so how does it make you feel when a woman does that? And how can she be independent and make her man feel validated at the same time?
  • Mr. Mayor**DARKSTARZ INC PREZ**: Everybody wants to feel needed by the person they are with and any real man would be impressed with a woman who can handle her own but if she makes him feel as though he is unnecessary that’s when it gets to be a problem… It’s the simple things… let him open a door, lift a box, yes a woman can do it for herself but a gentleman should never let her. I’m begging women in my life now to do their part in reviving and keeping chivalry alive.
  • Me:  So it makes you feel needed? And you like doing those things? Do you ever think to give her emotional support too? Or must it always be tangible things?
  • Mr. Mayor**DARKSTARZ INC PREZ**: I’m not in a relationship now… but when I was I was more than capable of giving emotional support… but try giving that to a woman who feels like she being babied if a man is just concerned about her. For example I may say “baby are you alright?” because I sense something is wrong with her… her response may be something like “don’t worry about me I’m gonna always be ok… So what am I here for if I don’t or can’t do anything for you?
  • So, That is a testament to the type of woman who you chose to be with… that is NOT an independent woman. That is a dysfunctional female…lmao!
  • Mr. Mayor**DARKSTARZ INC PREZ**: Well when they are addressed they identify themselves as independent woman… and if that the case I would hate to view every woman who came off  “overly independent” as “dysfunctional women” But I will if I have too…LOL Now on the other hand if you are implying that “independent women” as a whole have perfect balance we would have to agree to disagree and I would do so purely from my personal experiences.
  • Me: I disagree because a person who must announce does not or is not. You don’t go around on a daily basis shouting “I’m a Man!” So, if she feels she is truly independent people will tell her, but you will never hear her cast that title on herself. It is the imbalanced and dysfunctional females playing dress-up in a real woman’s clothing that feel the need to shout how independent that they are. Because, in all honesty, an independent woman can’t wait for a man… THE RIGHT MAN…to come along and compliment her strength. When she feels safe enough, she will hand him her entire load and gladly let him have it so that she can be power woman at the office and a catered woman at night. So again… we mustn’t let our experiences overshadow the facts of the matter. If I let my experiences with dudes overshadow the facts of what a man is supposed to be…..we wouldnt even be having this conversation. So I’ll continue to separate dogs from men if you promise to separate faux females in dress-up mode from independent women. Because Independent woman does not mean independent from the love and support of a man, it means she is independent from the stereotypes placed on her by association with her gender and excels in spite of barriers.  Capiche?
  • Mr. Mayor**DARKSTARZ INC PREZ**: Capiche! You have my word and trust I’m not saying that I don’t have hope that I will one day find a woman of that caliber I just can’t speak on what hasn’t happened… But my eyes, heart and mind are open the very possibility of that opportunity…
  • Me: Until then… you can’t say that you have come in contact with an independent woman then. You have come in contact with women who are trying to prove that they are independent and failing miserably. lol

         And then it hit me….. these guys are responding the way that they are because there are imposters out there wearing an Independent Woman’s clothes! Yes…. just as there are boys out there sporting a man’s attire, we have imposters on the woman’s side as well. So, the guys aren’t upset with a true independent woman, but rather her flunkie; her wanna be. This is completely understandable. And unfortunately, there is no way to show him what an independent woman is because much like good men, by the time the people who need to them they have stopped believing in their existence it is seeming too late because the indepedent women have given up.  But there is hope.. I know there is. Like I said above, if I havent let me viewpoint of a man change because of a few bad ones, I just ask that men not let their view of the independent woman be tainted because a few imposters just can’t get it right. Each person is an individual and independent of your past relationships and experiences…. this is my belief.

Sincerely,

~*My Mother’s Daughter*~

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